Sazmining Podcast Episode 11: Scott Hancock on Bitcoin Mining's Capital

Synopsis: In this episode of The Sazmining Podcast, Will speaks with Scott Hancock, Chief Business Development Officer of BitRiver Mining. They discuss artificial intelligence, the next Bitcoin halving, and the dynamics of capital allocation in Bitcoin mining.

Will Szamosszegi (00:04):

Welcome to the SA mining podcast at SA mining, we are bringing you into conversations with today's industry leaders and blockchain and cryptocurrency. Our goal with this podcast is to improve the understanding and adoption of blockchain and cryptocurrency by giving you an insider's look at what's being built and inform predictions on what the future holds today's episode is sponsored by block by and cogent law group. Our listeners can visit block by.com/sa mining for an exclusive offer for cryptocurrency management and check out cogent law group for all your legal needs. Today's guest is the chief business development officer at fit river mining, the largest hosting provider for mining in the CIS. Welcome to the podcast, Scott,

Scott Hancock (01:05):

Thank you for having me will excited to be here.

Will Szamosszegi (01:08):

Excited to have you, could you just talk a little bit about your journey that led you to what you're working on today in mining at bit river?

Scott Hancock (01:16):

So I'm a political science major. I had some twists and turns that got me into the technology industry back in 2006. Uh, I randomly had an opportunity to take a job doing, uh, data center, enterprise style, um, networking server in storage equipment sales in orange county, California. And I figured at the time that if I didn't like take this opportunity, then I probably would be kind of hanging around the DC beltway area for life. So I wanted to venture out west and try something new. And I've been in, uh, the tech industry ever since had my own consulting company for a while. Um, dealt with a lot of Cisco, Oracle, HP, and related hosting services and other services up until around 2017. I started getting really interested in crypto. I'd heard about it before and, uh, first invested in Bitcoin and Ethereum in the summer of 2017.

Scott Hancock (02:31):

Then as I researched everything more and more, I realized I had all these, the fundamental skills that were probably applicable to the Bitcoin mining industry. So I got into the Bitcoin mining industry in early 2018 and haven't looked back, it's been, uh, a lot of fun, uh, exciting work, definitely ups and downs, which I think just comes with the territory. Yes. So just a couple months ago, Igor at bit river hired me and it's, it's been a lot of fun working with bit river. And I think, um, from, from my experience the last couple years, I can easily say that bit river has a top five Bitcoin mining hosting facility in the world in terms of quality and cost.

Will Szamosszegi (03:25):

Yeah. Well, that's great to hear, I know that on the podcast we've covered hosting before and how that's important within the cryptocurrency mining industry, but just to dive into a little bit more depth on hosting and particularly, uh, bit rivers hosting. Can you talk a little bit about what it is that you guys are doing when you're taking other people's equipment and running it on their behalf?

Scott Hancock (03:49):

Yes, so we, we just really value providing like an optimal hosting environment for these Bitcoin mining computers. If, uh, you research the industry over the last, like three to six months, you'll hear a lot of chatter about different, uh, mining groups that purchased S 17 plus miners from Bitmain being less than thrilled with their experience with those minors. And there was a lot of failure rates at a lot of mining facilities, lots of, um, just issues with them, not lasting and, uh, needing, needing to be repaired. And what we found is a lot of that just comes down to maintaining the environment properly, having the right temperature and just being proactive about maintaining that, that mining environment. So we have certified Bitmain technicians on staff that actually, uh, are on a 24 7 basis making sure that these Bitcoin mining computers that investors spend so much capital on are mining the amount of Bitcoin they should be and not having failure rates that are uncalled for. So we had a really low failure rate with S 17 plus for example, but it's things like that, that we really pay close attention to at bit river that I think oftentimes are overlooked with a lot of mining groups and co-location providers.

Will Szamosszegi (05:25):

Yeah. I mean, that's one of the things when, whenever I hear about companies that are getting into hosting or trying to host other people's equipment, the first question is, well, how is your current uptime looking today? And how many failures are you experiencing? That's one of the things where if you're going to go out and let's say, get into mining by purchasing just the equipment and going with a hosting provider, you wanna make sure that they're actually going to run the equipment properly, and you're not gonna hear that 10% of your equipment ended up breaking while running at their facility. Let's say that there are certain types of failures. What does that look like from, uh, from a moving forward basis, if something like that were to happen?

Scott Hancock (06:11):

Sure. So sadly, uh, to be more specific at some of these hosting, um, companies that hosted S 17 pluses, they had even as high as like 30% failure rates, which is crazy, cause you spend a lot of money on these Finers. Um, but we, to there with, with all these mining manufacturers right now, everybody's still perfecting the product. So you do expect some issues with the equipment and we have a repair center on site, so we can quickly repair any deficiencies in the minor and get 'em back up and mining Bitcoin as soon as possible. So we've really thought about all of the different ways that we can be one of the best hosting providers in the world. And we are doing everything we can to be just that.

Will Szamosszegi (07:08):

Yeah, well that, that's good to hear when an, a piece of equipment, like, let's say an ASIC that's ordered breaks down, it seems like you guys have a very good relationship with Bitmain. You have bitten name, certified technicians on site. Are there certain benefits that you guys derive from the size of your orders from a warranty standpoint, or is that something that it's pretty consistent among all types of sizes when ordering?

Scott Hancock (07:32):

That's an interesting question. So I do think that bit river is considered a VI I P client by a lot of the mining manufacturers. What's difficult right now, especially during, uh, during COVID I've heard that some of the warranty repair centers in north America for, for that Bitmain has traditionally had open and available. Haven't been able to accommodate all of the demand to repair like S 17 plus machines. Uh, we keep talking about those, but just, um, in general, you lately you have to ship the miners all the way back to China to, to get them repaired. And then they ship them back or Bitmain will do coupons. So when you really look at, you know, the pros and cons of, of getting the minors repaired on site and paying a reasonable fee to do that at bit river or the lost time and lost revenue you have from mining Bitcoin, waiting for the manufacturer to figure out what the issue was and issue a coupon or whatever they do to try to keep the client happy.

Scott Hancock (08:47):

Oftentimes it makes sense to just repair the minor in house, but it's been a big problem in the industry because a lot, lot of capital is invested by groups that don't quite understand the, the industry yet and what they're getting into. And when you experience a significant amount of downtime that provides issues all the way around, like there could be, uh, the, the hosting company could be leasing their facility. And because of the downtime, they're not, they're not meeting their obligations to the power company. So things just, uh, go south really quick hosting company files, bankruptcy, uh, the, the people who own the facility feel like they're not responsible for it. So they want to keep the minors. And then the actual investors who put mining machines at that facility, they're upset because they want their mining machines back. And unfortunately this has happened a lot in this space.

Scott Hancock (09:51):

So I think that's why it's so critical to choose the right hosting provider and the case of bit river you're dealing with. We have, we have like 40 million worth mining equipment on side site and just a, a really well known and respected brand globally to protect. So we take our obligations really seriously. And I think that there's a lot of, um, sometimes geopolitical factors that, that get looked at when really you could be at you, you could be at way more risk having your minors at a facility in Texas where it's hot and humid and you're having failures left and right. So it's, it's a lot to consider for

Will Szamosszegi (10:38):

Sure. Yeah. There, I mean, there are definitely so many factors to consider. You actually brought up a really interesting one that I've talked with a couple of MI different minors about on the podcast, but I'd be really interested to hear your take on it and that's regulation and where if you're building these facilities, what jurisdiction you're under, for example, some people might just feel more comfortable if their equipment is being hosted in the us versus internationally. And there are other times where foreign investor might not necessarily want to go and host in the us, they feel much more comfortable. They're Chinese investor keeping their mining operations in China. What do you think is the best place to host your equipment and how important do you think it is to consider where you're building your facility

Scott Hancock (11:26):

On a country to country basis? Well, speaking about the, the CIS and, and Russia, for example, I think that you really have to take into consideration, um, changes in the political landscape. And I think, um, with where, um, in, in ear COOs and relationships that are in place with, um, very reputable energy providers, like M plus group, for example, go a long way and, and weighing the, um, the political risks associated with where you're placing your mining equipment. So if you're looking at a, uh, facility in New York, for example, and you're in the us, and you're definitely only open to facilities in the us, then you wanna look at the, the local jurisdiction and how just the, the local politicians feel about Bitcoin and crypto mining, and also really examine how, how the energy is being provided to the facility. If it's a fixed rate, or if the rates are subject to change, or if, you know, new elected officials could come in and, and change things up, um, that's all something to consider, but you, you really wanna just make sure you have constant access to power. So if something happens to the power and your, your minors at a facility, it's, it, it usually takes at least 30 days to move them to a new facility. So you don't want to be in that situation where you have your minor somewhere and they're not mining <laugh>.

Will Szamosszegi (13:11):

Yeah, that would, that would be a very unfortunate situation.

Scott Hancock (13:15):

It happens all too much right now.

Will Szamosszegi (13:18):

<laugh> oh yeah. What do you think is going to happen as this industry continues to progress? Cause right now we're, we're just over 10 years in Bitcoin mining since this started. And it was a very different industry in the early days when people could mind Bitcoin on their laptops. And now today you have these huge facilities. You have people with their special types of proprietary designs to mine as much Bitcoin as possible. Where do you think it's gonna be in the next 10 years? For example,

Scott Hancock (13:48):

I think that it's, it's obvious to everybody that this space is gonna be reserved more and more to large capital institutional groups and, um, high net worth investors. And it's gonna be harder and harder for just smaller sized mining deployments to, um, to happen. I have clients come to me with, you know, a $50,000 budget and it's hard to find a solution that makes a lot of sense for minors like that. Whereas, you know, before the having, you could, you could do some things with $50,000 today. It's it's really, really difficult. So I think that as mass adoption continues, we just saw, you know, gray scale do a national TV ad campaign that everybody saw and, you know, banks are noticing it, governments are noticing it and being able to just have access to cheap electricity and get a power purchase agreement in place and build a facility and maintain that facility.

Scott Hancock (15:06):

It's expensive. It's not a little kid's game anymore. So, um, I think that we're just, we're going see the space get smaller and smaller, uh, in a lot of ways, but the groups and providers and mining entities that are left are going to be very, very serious knowledgeable players. So I think there's been, uh, a lot of weeding out of, um, smaller groups that haven't really had the expertise necessary to survive in the space and regulation continues to happen globally. And I think that's a good thing because big investors, they, they want to, um, have reg regulation in place prior to doing, you know, a seven figure investment. So, you know exactly what you're dealing with when you have uncertainties that makes doing a seven figure investment, a lot more difficult. So I think everything's just coming to fruition more and more where large capital, even more so than today, large capital groups are going to continue to enter the space and just, um, it'll be, it'll be a interesting race to watch.

Scott Hancock (16:30):

So getting into 10 years from now, it it's even gonna be a smaller, smaller space, smaller group than it is right now. And it'll be interesting to see where things are at in 10 years, but just between now and the next having, after we have another having event, you're gonna see the same thing, um, that happened this time around where groups and facilities and, um, investors that didn't upgrade their machines. All of a sudden, they're, they're stuck in a very difficult position and finally bankruptcy and, and just dropping the ball on their investors, which hopefully that lesson's been learned a lot now. And we don't repeat a lot of that. Um, but yeah, the space is getting smaller and smaller and as it becomes more and more difficult to mine, Bitcoin, it's just gonna be very reserved for large capital players and experts in the space,

Will Szamosszegi (17:33):

The backbone to be able to create more mining or another mining facility is capital. You need the capital to be able to go purchase the equipment, build everything out, and then start hashing with, with more and more machines and investors from their perspective, they're thinking, okay, well, what, what's the risk that I'm taking on here to get involved, to invest in mining? I understand the fundamentals of it, but this would be the first time that as in meant for many of these investors that they're actually dipping their toe in and getting, getting involved, how do you think that capital allocation into mining is going to progress between now and the next having?

Scott Hancock (18:16):

I think that we're gonna see more and more serious capital and just institutional money, money from government coming in, um, investing in mining because it it's really fundamentally, the proof of work concept is, is very viable. And I think as we have a lot of, um, uncertainties with global currencies around the world, Bitcoin is really proving to be a safe Haven. So we are going to see, um, just more, I, I would say in the next, let's say two years, you're gonna see at least 50% more capital invested into the mining space. Probably more like a hundred percent. So <laugh>,

Will Szamosszegi (19:05):

That's a great, uh, prediction though. Um, I think I, I tend to agree with that. I think that there's gonna be more capital coming in. You also touched on just the macro environment that is, is really in Bitcoin's favor as an inflation hedge asset class. Think that we've already seen year to date, how well it's performed. I mean, many people just point to that initial liquidity crisis in March where Bitcoin fell over 50% in the day. And then they say, see, Bitcoin, it, it ended up performing poorly. And in, in correlation with the rest of the market, when it's supposed to be an inflation hedge asset, that's what many of the people said after that it happened, who were the doubters of Bitcoin and really we're trying to attack Bitcoin, but then you've kind of seen them go silent as the year has progressed after that as Bitcoin's performed incredibly well. And now is I actually haven't checked the prices today while we're recording this on August 26th, but I think it's in the ballpark of like 11 to 12 K. So it'ss obviously done very well since that time. What do you think is actually going to happen in terms of price action of Bitcoin between now and the next having?

Scott Hancock (20:19):

Well, I think in the next year we are going to see Bitcoin being over $20,000. I think

Will Szamosszegi (20:28):

I love the price predictions by the way.

Scott Hancock (20:30):

Yeah, I think it'd be very surprising if we don't see that sometime in 2021, just as, um, investors are looking for ways to hedge investments, you're looking at real estate and gold and then, you know, the real estate, uh, Bitcoin, which is mining and that the fact that Bitcoin just became harder to mine ha inherently makes it more valuable also. So, um, over the next couple of years, it wouldn't surprise me at all. If we saw the price of Bitcoin over six figures, um, I think that's the way things are headed, but I try to stay because there's so many uncertainties when looking at any investment, I try to, you know, look at the next year and not too much further than that. So yeah, $20,000, I think it's gonna happen in 2021.

Will Szamosszegi (21:36):

Well, I think that, uh, that prediction will age, well,

Scott Hancock (21:39):

<laugh> a, a new all time high, so we'll say greater than 20.

Will Szamosszegi (21:45):

Yeah. And the, the funny thing is, is that when you look at a price prediction like that, when you talk with people in crypto, they totally get it. They think, yeah, I could definitely see that happening. I might even see it going higher. And then you have the conservative people thinking it might not, not go that high, but then if you talk with anyone outside of crypto about these price predictions, they look at you like, you're crazy because I mean, what you just, what you just laid out is almost like a 100%, uh, return from where Bitcoin is today. But I think that from a mining standpoint, uh, we have a very good understanding of the fundamentals that are driving, how new Bitcoin's created the monetary policy behind how new Bitcoin is created, and then a look directly at the supply demand economics of how many Bitcoin there actually are.

Scott Hancock (22:38):

Exactly. And right now, um, there's somewhat of a supply issue for just really efficient minors. You've got Bitman micro BT, I think strong U just came out with a new minor. So, um, mining Bitcoin is definitely, uh, a complicated endeavor. And then just, I, I think if you mind the right way, and then just compared to purchasing the Bitcoin outright, you can do way better, uh, with a return on investment than just owning the coin. But of course it's a capital intensive investment, but I think a lot of, um, hosting providers today will just, um, portray the, uh, certain minors to be a good long term play. And I really believe that the best way to mine efficiently is continue to be upgrading to, you know, the most efficient, minor that's available and take advantage of market cycles. When, um, next year, if we see that cycle happen where Bitcoin really goes on a run and goes over $20,000, then historically what happens is the price of the, uh, mining equipment even used mining equipment. It might double in value. So you can sell your used miners for maybe twice as much as what you bought them for brand new and simultaneously upgrade to the latest most minor and continue to just be, you know, mining the maximum amount of Bitcoin possible while really being strategic about it. And not trying to get too much life out of, out of a

Will Szamosszegi (24:42):

Aging equipment

Scott Hancock (24:42):

Minor that, you know, has been around a long time and, you know, you get what you pay for. So,

Will Szamosszegi (24:49):

Yeah, that's, that's another thing that, that we also focus on is trying to evaluate the proper cycles. And I, I want to dive a little bit more in depth with you on this topic to figure out how, how are you assessing these cycles? What are those key variables that you're looking at, where, but now that this is the picture, and this is what we're seeing in the mining environment now we're deciding, okay, it's time to, re-up, it's time to sell. It's time to go and, uh, buy new equipment and sell off this old equipment. How do you assess that internally at, at the firm,

Scott Hancock (25:23):

What we are doing at bit river, we expect our investors and clients to come in with some knowledge about what they're getting into with mining Bitcoin, because, uh, it is so capital intensive. You should definitely do a lot of research prior to making your mining investment. So we're, we're more focused on, uh, groups that know what they're doing and, you know, my experience in the space, I'll definitely provide insight and recommendations the best I can to new capital groups entering the space. But I think there's a lot of just, um, really, really good published reports and data on what's been successful with, with mining in the past and Matt DeSouza of, uh, block wear. He's published just some, some awesome reports that I would encourage anybody to Google and he, he just passed away today. Um, so that, that was really, really, uh, sad news, but Matt was great for the space and, and we need more people like Matt, because he, he just provided like, accurate, very, um, open and just, you know, know honest data that I, I don't think everybody

Will Szamosszegi (26:46):

See, I, I never heard, I didn't hear about that. Yeah. What happened?

Scott Hancock (26:51):

Uh, he had been battling cancer for a while, so yeah, but I don't think anybody expected this, so it, it, my condolences to Matt and his family and, um, the, the block wear team.

Will Szamosszegi (27:10):

Yeah. I mean, I personally, I I'd never spoken with him, but I'd been following his, his work for a while. Uh, and I mean, yeah, he, he was putting out great, great stuff for the space, so that that's unbelievably sad. I mean, yeah. He, he was really, really great for the crypto mining industry too.

Scott Hancock (27:27):

Yeah. So, um, just going back to your question, I think that there's a lot of resources available. Like, um, you, you can calculate the return at a number of different sites with Bitcoin mining calculators, depending on the energy rate. You're looking at how much the machine costs, what the current difficulty is to mine, Bitcoin and project, what your IRR is going to be. Um, what we are doing at bit river to help with that process is providing some of the best hosting rates and service available in the whole world to just ensure once you actually make that huge investment, that you are getting maximum efficiency outta that minor.

Will Szamosszegi (28:14):

Yeah. Yeah, definitely. You wanna make sure that when you're, when you're hosting somewhere that you're, you're maximizing that, that return and the amount of cash rate that you're getting out of out, out of the minors that you bought, that many people in the mining space, they have a way that they like to go about evaluating what's happening, what's going to happen, and they have their own outlook on the industry. Is there a belief that you hold to be true about crypto mining or blockchain in general, that you would say many other people that are within the industry and actually understand it disagree with so any contrarian beliefs?

Scott Hancock (28:51):

Hmm. I would say just consistently get second opinions. I think that there's kind of like an old guard in the space that's been around for a while and likes to really portray themselves as experts and, um, treat, treat kind of their advice. Like it's the Bible, but typically what what's happening with with, you know, some of these experts that have been around the space for the, for a while is whatever they're recommending. There's a financial motive behind that. So I would just encourage anyone looking in at getting into mining to look at several different options and not just say, okay, I'm I like this particular group or person, so I'm gonna go with what they recommend. Um, what I like to do with clients that come into bit river is, is just help them get, get the best cost possible. Whether that's like with a particular mining pool or purchasing the minors, where oftentimes you can go through secondary market sources and, um, sometimes pay like quite the premium.

Scott Hancock (30:10):

Um, so I'll help clients go direct and deal with the manufacturers to get the best possible price. Um, so just, just really analyze how many layers there are between you and, and the actual source of whatever it is you're purchasing, because, uh, since everything is all about your ROI, you wanna make sure you're getting the best price possible. If it's for, you know, infrastructure you're paying surrounding your mining operation, or the actual mining computers, mining, farm management, the software you're using to manage your farm, um, whatever it is there there's oftentimes a lot of layers. So just it's, I think it's, it's nice to be able to just get through that as much as possible. So you're really paying what you should be paying for the products and services that are available in this space.

Will Szamosszegi (31:15):

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Will Szamosszegi (32:32):

What is the most interesting development that you're seeing in technology could be blockchain related, but could definitely be outside of blockchain, just any type of advancement and technology that you're noticing that that's really fascinating.

Scott Hancock (32:47):

I would say lately during, you know, this global COVID pandemic, just the everybody's seeing how much, um, AI is gonna be part of our, our future that, um, you know, we, we are ne not needed for a lot of, uh, everyday jobs that we've seen over the years. Uh, computers can do those jobs and, uh, just just different technologies are available where a lot of the traditional services and, uh, labor related, especially service industry jobs that have been around for decades really aren't there anymore. So I think that, um, this skill that we're gonna see taught to, to kids and taught and colleges are gonna be much more specialized. And, um, we, we might see some industries just kind of vanish that, that we've come to know and expect over the years.

Will Szamosszegi (33:56):

What are some of those industries that you think are because of AI going to really get hit the hardest

Scott Hancock (34:02):

Well, because of technology or just different services that are available, or just, uh, we're realizing right now, they're, I think everybody's seeking out like the most efficient way to do things. Um, so if that's like with the food industry, you can get your food delivered a lot easier these days, and you can just, um, avoid going to crowded restaurants as much. So I think the restaurant industry is getting hit really hard right now. It's obvious. And, um, it may not ever get back quite to, um, going out every Friday night with your family sort of thing. You might just use Uber eats and have the food delivered. So

Will Szamosszegi (34:58):

Yeah, I read something fascinating the other day about this, this exact topic. So you got, you know, the guy who founded Uber, Travis. Yeah. He's no longer with Uber. He went and started another company I'm blanking on the name, but it was a way to transform the, the food industry. What they're doing is he's imagining similar kind of to what you just said at different landscape for how this industry's going to look in the future and what he was saying or that what he's building are these mega kitchens, where they can have a central location where many different brands can all be preparing their foods for delivery. And in doing that capturing a larger share of you could just think of everyone's belly, the amount of food that's being eaten. And so it's really interesting because if you really dive into it and think about it, you could have 20, 30, 40 different brands of companies selling different types of food on Uber eats or these different delivery sources, but they could all be owned by a single company and just have some sort of agreement with Travis's company.

Will Szamosszegi (36:08):

That is the mega building. That's hosting all the, all of the kitchens where these different foods are being created. And I'm just thinking, wow, that's incredible. There's, they're going to, in a way, transform the way that people are, uh, buying, eating, really just consuming all this food by making use of the different platforms that are now available. So I thought when I heard that business model, I thought it was really interesting and well, we'll see how it ends up playing out with Travis and, and everyone else who's going and trying to get into and compete in that space.

Scott Hancock (36:45):

Yeah. So when you are thinking about going to olive garden and somebody else in the group wants to go to Outback, uh, you could just go to, you know, one place and everybody can get what they want from, you know, Uber eats or Travis's company where just the specific brand of one restaurant might become more obsolete. So,

Will Szamosszegi (37:13):

Yeah, cuz I mean, I don't know about you, but whenever I'm looking for food on Uber eats or what any of these delivery sites, I'm just thinking, what type of food do I want I'm am I, are we going for like Chinese? Are we going for Italian? And then just through that category, we'll kind of look at the pricing, but just order it from there. And do you have the single company that is hosting where all this food's being cooked? I think it's, it's a pretty interesting opportunity. Uh, you don't even need the brand. You can just be the, the warehouse that's hosting all the brands.

Scott Hancock (37:47):

I, I agree. Um, I've, I've just gone usually to my Chipotle app because I try to eat, I try to eat healthy and I feel like every time I order Chipotle, that's a pretty healthy option. Even if I did it, you know, this was the fourth day in a row, then I'm still getting healthy food for the fourth day in a row. So

Will Szamosszegi (38:11):

<laugh> yeah, Chipotle's good too.

Scott Hancock (38:13):

Well, when I was in downtown Denver recently, it would take like an hour if I wanted to go out and just order even like fast, faster food options, uh, because of traffic and lines. So I would just order Chipotle on a regular basis.

Will Szamosszegi (38:31):

<laugh> there you go. What is your favorite book that you've ever read?

Scott Hancock (38:37):

I, Hmm, I really enjoyed brave new world by Aldi Huxley. I like to just think critically about stuff. Even when, when I read brave new world in high school, it just got me to really think about the world in, in a different way and, and challenge kind of stereo stereotypical views and just, you know, push, push buttons of, of people that kind of wanna see the world through rose colored glasses. Um, so I think brave new world did that and I, I really enjoyed reading that book and what's, uh, what's interesting is I'm thinking about this today is a lot of those things that Aldi Huxley predicted, um, ages ago really, uh, look a lot like the world we're in today, so that book's standing out right now in particular,

Will Szamosszegi (39:39):

Those are the type of books that make you question things when you're reading it, you're thinking, huh, I've never looked at it that way and it's not like my existing views, right. And this book's completely wrong. It's just, it's a way that gets people to think about things in a different way. Those are, those are some of the most fascinating books to read. So one of the things I also wanted to ask is what is your favorite movie?

Scott Hancock (40:04):

Hmm, one of my, one of my favorite movies because I got into sales right outta college. Um, I, I, I think that you really have to be persistent and, and just not, not scared to talk to the person on, on the other end of the phone or the video, or if you're speaking in front of a group of people, you, you just have to go after it. So, uh, I, I really liked boiler room because I felt like those guys were just like really cranking and had a lot, brought a lot of energy to the room, um, despite what they were or were not selling. Um, I thought boiler room was pretty entertaining doing, um, being in the technology sales industry for the last like 15 years or so. Uh,

Will Szamosszegi (41:03):

Yeah, I just looked it up. Um, so, so it's gotta been diesel

Scott Hancock (41:07):

<laugh> yeah. In the early days, I'm 37 years old. So we might remember, you know, different movies as, as favorites <laugh>

Will Szamosszegi (41:17):

Yeah. I I'll have to check it out. It sounded familiar. I that's one, one of the reasons why I wanted to look it up, as soon as you brought it, uh, brought it up as your favorite movie, maybe I'll watch it.

Scott Hancock (41:30):

I like tombstone a lot. So nothing super relevant about, you know, cowboy times these days, but that was pretty entertaining movie.

Will Szamosszegi (41:44):

Yeah. Well, those were some good recommendations.

Scott Hancock (41:47):

Awesome. I'll look out for your tweet on how much you enjoyed them. <laugh>,

Will Szamosszegi (41:51):

That's actually one of the things that I've always tried. Like there have been times where I've tried to get into tweeting and it's just been so difficult managing and being involved in all these different things. I gotta get back on Twitter at some point.

Scott Hancock (42:04):

It's cool to just check out like day to day developments, especially in the crypto and mining space, there's updates all over the place on Twitter. So I really enjoy being on there. Just, just to get a quick industry update in the morning and I'm fairly active, um, doing, you know, tweets and LinkedIn posts.

Will Szamosszegi (42:31):

Yeah. That's great. Kind

Scott Hancock (42:32):

Of contribute.

Will Szamosszegi (42:33):

Yeah. I mean, that, that is really great to hear well.

Scott Hancock (42:36):

Yeah. And I got,

Will Szamosszegi (42:38):

Where can people connect with you on online? What are your, what are your handles?

Scott Hancock (42:43):

I'm on telegram Scotty underscore Bitcoin. Uh, I'm on crypto. Uh, I'm I'm on, uh, Twitter and it's, uh, at, just at Scotty Bitcoin. Uh, let's see.

Will Szamosszegi (42:59):

<laugh>

Scott Hancock (43:00):

Yeah. Trying to think. LinkedIn, you can just find me searching Scott Hancock and probably plug in bit river also because there's hundreds of Scott Hancock out there. <laugh> so

Will Szamosszegi (43:14):

Well, Scott, this has been unbelievably fun, really, really happy that you had the chance to come onto the podcast. And thanks again. We'll do it again sometime.

Scott Hancock (43:25):

Absolutely.

Will Szamosszegi (43:27):

Thank you for listening to this episode of the SAS mining podcast. Be sure to follow us on social media and YouTube for the latest updates and previews of upcoming episodes, full episodes and transcripts can be found on SA mining.com every Thursday. If you want to hear us interview a particular guest on a future episode, please reach out to us@podcastsamining.com.

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